Arizona Biodiesel Locations and Prices

[darth_diesel]

Two questions for you, BioBoss:

1) What form does this 250 gallons take? Do you bring it in a big ol' mega-tote? 5 smaller ones? Do we need to provide containers? Can we get a single 55-gallon drum or tote? (I don't use enough for 250 to make sense...it's quite literally a 6 months' supply for me.)

2) Can you help out with a pump as well? If so, what are the options, and how much do they cost? If not, which ones have you had good experience with? (It'd be just for me; I'm close enough to you guys that there's no benefit to anyone coming here to fill up as opposed to your location.)

This would be going in my garage, where there's PLENTY of room. (3-car garage, and I'm only using 1 car of it.)

If there's anything I should know, just toss it out there.

Thanks!

-Mike

[aztdijetta]

BioBoss:
I support what you are doing 100%. Hang in there!!!

So much so that I am willing to drive from 19th & Deer Valley (work) to pick up as much as I can to fill up my car tank and as my 5 gallon containers as I can fit into my trunk. And that is at 45 cents more than I can buy regular diesel locally. I'll be by in the next week to purchase fuel.

You are right, biodiesel is better for the environment.
It reduces your engine wear.
It's not produced by some foreign country with the possibility of supporting terrorists.
It's keeps money in our country to help our economy.
It decreases the chances of us going to war over oil.
It conserves what little cheap crude is left for us and our children. After all, there is not enough biodiesel for every car in the world. And this save us money indirectly.
It's sustainable and non toxic.

We need to support Dan now so that he is around in the future when prices skyrocket again and they will. I don't have money to throw around either, but this is a worthy investment. If we can get something going on the west side it will be even easier for us. Pxsteel is looking into setting something up. I think he just needs a pump.

I am in it for the long haul.

OK, I'll get off my soap box now.

Dan

[SoyBug]

I have no doubt that part of the reason we're seeing the free-fall in gasoline and dino diesel prices is to kill off E85 and biodiesel. If you look at how much the usage of both fuels has gone up just in 2007 from the year before and the expected increase in usage for 2008, you know the oil companies and the big cartel have gotta be getting nervous. The oil barons know the alternative fuel companies are still in their infancy and lowering gasoline and petroleum diesel prices right now, after the ethanol and BD makers have invested millions of dollars, could be a fatal blow. The oil companies, meanwhile, can afford to weather a few quarters of lower prices after the record profits they've posted in recent years. A few months ago one of the head honchos at OPEC released a statement about how much he didn't appreciate efforts to use alternative fuels in the United States! My reply: Just keep on buying biodiesel, whenever you can.

[BioBoss]

Wow,

Thanks for all the kind words of support.
Anyone mind if we cut and paste a few of these posts to our web site to try to educate some people???

As for the bulk purchase question..........

We have several ways to accommodate the 250 gallon discount purchase:

Remember, the extra cost of a one time investment for the supplies should get offset by saving you trips to our fuel pump and the discount you get. When you need a refill, we deliver free!!!!
You could even charge your friends a small fee for saving them a trip and to help pay for the equipment.
With a little team work, we all win!!!

1- yes, the behemoth, 250 gallon tote (small deposit, whatever we can get them for at the time, check craigslist)

2- (5) 55 gallon plastic barrels (cheaper than a tote even for all 5 and one person can actually move a full barrel around the floor by himself)

3- this is a new option- prepay for 250 gallons and we'll keep track of what you use. We find companies like this and they just have their employees drive by, fill-up and sign the invoice.
A small group of diesel vehicle friends could do the same thing.
Give your group a name ("TDI Nice Guys", example) and give us a list of your people in the group and we'll keep track of who uses how much.
Barrels can even be setup to gravity feed so you don't have to get electric pumps. You do need a way to lay a barrel on its side just above the height of your fuel tank.

Remember, free delivery for all 250 gallon orders!!!

Here is a list of equipment from Northern Tool. They seem to have the best prices. If you want, you can have it shipped or bring it in to us and we'll get it all hooked up to your tote or barrel.
http://www.northerntool.com/webapp/wcs/ ... tName=REES

Thanks!!!!!!!!!!!
Dan "BioBoss"

[aztdijetta]

BioMass,
Feel free to use any of the material I have posted. I have a friend at work who took my Jetta for a test drive last week. He loved it. He has about ten Mercedes diesel cars. He will be by tonight with his truck to get some biod.

I am going to try and stop by on Thursday. Are there any days that you run out such that I should call ahead?

Take Care,
Dan

[ted]

3- this is a new option- prepay for 250 gallons and we'll keep track of what you use. We find companies like this and they just have their employees drive by, fill-up and sign the invoice.
A small group of diesel vehicle friends could do the same thing.

I'm interested, depending on the size of the group and the resulting prepay amount per person. Anyone else?

[jamest]

Filled up on Friday! I think I'll just keep it simple and just fill up whenever I need it and not worry about saving on the bulk.
I'm sad to see that AZ Biodiesel's bulk customers disappeared after the price of dino plummeted. Their prices are still very competitive, especially for bulk. You'd think people would support a local business making local, cleaner, fuel and not not be so worried about the few extra cents a gallon they are paying. Hang in there guys! Once the price of dino skyrockets again you'll have more customers than fuel. I might need to get a bulk 250 gal by then in my garage so I can fill up when you guys are sold out.

[h3ndrix]

A story:

I went on Saturday to Gilbert on less than a quarter of a tank to pick something up from a craigslist seller and to fuel up. I dragged into the parking lot at AZBiodiesel to a closed gate and a locked office building. I sat in my car, trying to get signal on my phone to see if they posted on their website an abrupt closing (no signs were posted that they were closed).

After I got out of my car, the mechanic from next door was detailing his new truck and asked me where the guys at AZBiodiesel was. I told him I didn't know, asked if they had been around at all that day and maybe just called the quits early. He said they had not. Out of a somewhat frustration I began digging around the forums for that 'after hours' cell phone number posted before. The mechanic, Jesse, then handed me a card with Randy(?)'s cell phone number. Told me to call him and tell him both him and I were needing fuel. Randy told me they were out of fuel until Monday after 3pm. I conceded defeat, I know these things happen. Jesse then called the same number and found out they had a few gallons left and would be able to put some in his new truck in a little bit. Again, my feelings aren't hurt--I work for a small company and I know that these kind of arrangements happen.

I told Jesse, with the disclaimer that I am not irate, that I would share this story.. I drove out from 48th and Chandler to get fuel, at a higher cost, to support the very post Dan had made the day before. I swear it. I had just read about how they needed our support to be here next year and at $3.75 when Petro would be $4.75. I drive my car with a sense of pride knowing I am supporting a local market and helping prevent further, unnecessary pollution.

I am not whining. I understand these things happen. I know what its like to deal with irrational customers. I know what its like to have to do 'unprofessional' acts. In their defense, when I got home, after filling up, a whole tank out of defiance mind you, at Flying J for $2.04 I saw that they had posted on their website that "Fuel Temporarily Available" -- note the typo that could be glanced out to be nothing more than a support of buying more fuel. Again, no one is perfect. They made an attempt to let us know they would be closed. I will make sure I check the website every time before filling up. This isn't a gripe, this is a sign of support. They are small outfit with one of their only means to communicate is on their website. I am actually glad I can see the price and status on the website as you don't get that kind of service from Chevron and the like.

Finally to end my "Gripe but Not" story--Randy called me yesterday afternoon. To tell me he had a few gallons left that he could sell me. I told him I had already filled up a full tank on petro but I appreciated the offer. I told him that I wasn't complaining but that it wasn't such an easy thing to drive all that way and find out they are closed. I also told him that calling me on a Sunday afternoon using the number I called him with the day before to offer me a solution was a great move and that I really appreciated his efforts--of course I will be going back to them.

I run my car on biodiesel, but more importantly I run it on AZBiodiesel. I sport the sticker on my window not for the self fulfillment of being a hippity dippity protector of the skies, but as a word-of-mouth advertiser. I want it for when I pass people on the freeway, they know their is a local, alternative fuel manufacturer and distributor. I contemplated telling this story because its so much of a nonissue now but I felt that if we are dealing with a real thing: fuel, the economy, local enivronment--people should be told the 'real experiences.' Again, this is just an experience I am not trying to bias towards it being positive or negative... its just what happened.

[ted]

You'd think people would support a local business making local, cleaner, fuel and not not be so worried about the few extra cents a gallon they are paying.

Those of us who are long-time users of biodiesel (for me it's been 5 years) are generally accustomed to paying around a 20 cents/gal premium for biodiesel compared to the lowest available petro diesel price, and for the rise and fall in the price of biodiesel to almost exactly track that of petro diesel. But the recent trend of 50 cents/gal above (in the case of AZ Bio's non-bulk price) to a dollar+ above (in the case of WSP) might cause many of those same people to either lower their ratio of bio-to-petro consumption or temporarily suspend using bio altogether. I totally understand the implications for new companies with significant start-up costs like AZ Biodiesel and Amereco that appeared on the market just at a time when all petro fuel prices are plummeting. I think it's great that AZ Biodiesel in particular is trying to be as consumer-friendly as possible with extended hours, bulk pricing, and even bulk-delivery. And I intend to support them as much as I'm able to.

[BioBoss]

Sorry for the Saturday issue.
Today also and now tomorrow late if we can finish our batches.

I hate to point fingers but, we ordered magnesol (our dry-wash agent) 2 weeks ago only to find out a week ago it never shipped. Then it was supposed to be here last Friday. Then Wednesday we find out the pallet never made it and was lost by the trucking company. Wednesday, we used our own trucking company and it was supposed to be here today (from Illinois). As of this afternoon it was in Nevada and we have been told it will be here tomorrow for sure.

We wouldn't have had any issues running out if we didn't run out of magnesol a week ago. Then it took another week for us to run out of our reserves.

We did post it on the web Friday as soon as we realized we would not have enough to be open on Saturday.
The last guy leaving Chandler Friday (Richie, not Randy) was supposed to post a sign saying we would be closed Saturday and that we expected to have fuel by Monday around 3pm. He ended up working until 10pm and forgot.......I gave him a minor beating for his error.

I was there Saturday afternoon and met Jesse from Gilbert Family Auto Repair across from us (great people there by the way if you need auto/truck repair, they service all our trucks. Honest, quality work.) and I noticed the signs didn't get put up so I did it myself (the one way to make sure things get done).

Please call or check the web for the most up to the minute info.
Please ignore typo's (Fuel Temporarily Available) sorry. I noticed that on Saturday and couldn't get it changed until today.

We changed our web info 3 times today as we continued to get new information.
We started the day expecting the magnesol before noon and thought we could have fuel by 3 today.
Then we were told the shipment wouldn't get here until late tomorrow so we changed the web to say 3pm Wednesday.
By 6 tonight the trucking company said it may get here by midnight (yeah sure) so they promissed to bring it first thing tomorrow (Tuesday). So now we're back to hopefully 3pm tomorrow but please call first or check the web.

So, God willing, we should have fuel either late tomorrow or Wednesday for sure.

Feel free to send nasty emails to the Dallas Group that sells magnesol as they are one of the worst companies in terms of customer service I have ever dealt with. We are looking into a different product to use so we can replace them. They even raised our costs recently which is another motivation to try to find a replacement.

The only good thing to come out of a week of not being able to make fuel is: we almost have our second centrifuge installed which will greatly assist in our ability to make fuel faster and hopefully a little cheaper as we will now be able pre-clean our oil with a centrifuge, making it amazingly clean and dewatered (for $60k it should sing us songs while it works). That should help reduce our chemical costs and if it does.......will enable us to lower our prices.

Just so you have a better inside as to our greatest cost to manufacture, it's the cost of methanol.
We have to use 22% methanol to create the chemical reaction to make biodiesel (I know most of you may already know this).
Methanol goes up and down with the cost of dino fuel because it is a byproduct of the refining process.
The prices however, are about a month behind in decreasing (even though increasing seemed to change quicker, go figure).
Though, if methanol goes down another 50 cents, that only changes our cost by about 10 cents. the reverse is also true which is why when dino fuel goes really high, we can be so much cheaper.

Hope this helps everyone to understand what we are going through and we will do our very best to always have the web up to the minute so you don't ever waste a trip......SORRY!!!!!!!!!

We really shouldn't have any issue with supply unless a supplier (like the Dallas Group) just screws us over again.

Thanks again for your support and suggestions.
We want to be "your" biodiesel company.
Dan, BioBoss

[BioBoss]

A story:

Jesse then called the same number and found out they had a few gallons left and would be able to put some in his new truck in a little bit. Again, my feelings aren't hurt--I work for a small company and I know that these kind of arrangements happen.

I need to explain what this was all about.

We had about 50 gallons of fuel left for our own vehicles to get by until Monday which is why we closed Saturday.

However, Jesse does us favors all the time by working on our pump truck and other vehicles on weekends and early mornings so we can keep our restaurants happy.

Richie was planning on meeting me at Gilbert early in the afternoon to get a few more things done.
He probably told Jesse he could have a few gallons to get by until we had more (as Jesse swears by our biodiesel).
Had Richie known (or if you had still been there) or if he thought you wanted to meet him there that afternoon, he would have given you fuel also. He didn't just go down to give Jesse fuel, he was coming in later anyhow and said if Jesse was still there he could have some.

These guys, (Richie & Mike especially) are usually down there 6-7 days a week trying to get things finished.
They were both there on Sunday and caught some "crackheads" breaking into the business' behind us and jumping into all the yards around us. Gilbert police responded swiftly and caught the truck and driver but the others got away. That made for another long Sunday as the police needed them to drive around with them to find the guys and identify the driver they caught.

Notice the signs in our yard:
"Trespassers will be shot, survivors will be shot again"

Hope that helps a little..............really, we didn't mean to snub you and really appreciate the effort and drive you make to support us.

Dan, BioBoss

[aztdijetta]

Thanks BioBoss for taking the time and providing some info into how you process works. That's was exactly some of the information I was interested in. It should give all us a better feeling of the issues you are up against as a new company. I also appreciate the constant web updates. I don't see this type of information from any other company that I have dealt with. Obviously customer satisfaction is very high on you priority list.

Once you have fuel either myself or a friend of mine (for both of us) will be picking up fuel.

Thanks again,
Dan

[darth_diesel]

I don't see this type of information from any other company that I have dealt with.

Seconded. Most companies are so obsessed with the "appear invincible" model of PR that they deny, deny, deny, and then when they can't deny anymore, make somebody a scapegoat.

It's really refreshing to see actual honesty and admissions of culpability on behalf of a business and business owner. Just makes me that much more happy to deal with you. By the way, I hope y'all are caught up...I need a fill-up on Monday.

I appreciate all the info about the bulk purchases...now I just need to determine whether having a 250 gallons of biodiesel in my garage is legal here in Mesa.

[aztdijetta]

I drove down Friday afternoon with a friend from work in his diesel Mercedes to AZBioDiesel. This was our first trip there. We picked up as much fuel in containers that would fit in his trunk and topped off his tank. We got to meet Dan. It was great talking with him. We gathered information into how his business works, how much waste oil he collects and how much he can process / store in one day, new processing methods, bulk delivery methods, pumps, cold weather concerns (or lack there of), etc.

I really appreciate the willingness of Dan to share all this with us. We learned a few things. He has a nice place and an expanding operation. He picked up a new waste oil collection tank truck. It looked new. I was impressed with Dan's quest to keep the quality of his fuel as high as possible. After my tank existing tank is empty, I will fill up completely with Dan's B99. Review to come. I am expecting great results.

All indications so far point towards a great business, caring owners, and high customer satisfaction. How refreshing! We will definitely be coming back. We need to support businesses like this.

Dan

[BioBoss]

I just need to determine whether having a 250 gallons of biodiesel in my garage is legal here in Mesa.

Let me know if you get a negative answer.
Biodiesel in fire code is the same as cooking oil.
Fire code rates it a #3 flammable product (#1 is the most and #4 the least)
Regular diesel will combust around 100+F while biodiesel is 300+F. Much safer.
A commercial building without sprinklers is allowed 13,200 gallons and double that if the building has sprinklers.
I wouldn't use the word "biodiesel" as the "diesel" part is all they may hear.

Honestly, we didn't ask the Gilbert Fire Marshall about home storage as we never considered there could be an issue.
I will have Richie (our engineer) look it up in the IFC (International Fire Code) book and get back to you with the "for sure" answer.

The Gilbert Fire Marshall was looking into (or maybe already was) home brewing!!!

Not sure if everyone heard that Phoenix Fire went after a home brewer and wrote him numerous code violations.
When they got to court, the "prosecutor" dismissed all the code violations (because he wasn't in violation of any fire codes) but still came down on him for the only thing they could find.........installing an electric outlet without a permit. How petty!!!

I only related this story as some Fire Marshalls will tell you "no" without really knowing or caring to really find out.
I don't have any first hand experience with Mesa so, I don't want to speculate.

Phoenix is where we had to move from (the second time, Chandler Zoning was our first road block) because the Fire Marshall didn't have a clue what he was talking about. We had 3 engineers at a meeting with him and after the meeting they all said "that Fire guy isn't going to approve anything". Every time they would explain to him that he was wrong a showed him the actual fire code, he made it clear, he didn't care.

The moral to this story is:
It isn't laws and codes that rule........ it's the guy that has the power to see it his own way.
And you thought that only happened in third world countries didn't you!

Did you know they can't be stopped or fired ??? A little scary the power some officials have and how some of them really like to show it to you.
The Chandler Zoning guy (which is what forced us to leave Chandler) actually sat and smiled as he enjoyed showing he was boss no matter what city elected officials wanted or other cities zoning was or common sense showed.

Gilbert was the only city that really cared about biodiesel and all the officials wanted us to move there.
THEY ACTUALLY CALLED US AND INVITED US TO SET UP IN THERE CITY !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
GILBERT RULES !!!

I'm trying to spend more time at the Gilbert plant and hope to meet all of you soon and have really enjoyed meeting some of you already.
Thanks again,
Dan "BioBoss"